2009 Arizona Real Estate Outlook - Bob Bemis

by John Wake on January 4, 2009

[I've asked some of the top Arizona real estate numbers geeks a few questions to see what they think 2009 might hold for the Arizona real estate market. John]

Bob Bemis, CEO of ARMLS

Bob Bemis joined ARMLS as CEO in October, 2007, and immediately began an aggressive program of expanding the product options and raising the quality of customer service and support offered to ARMLS’s 35,000 REALTORS®. He has concentrated on reinforcing infrastructure, including a new core MLS system delivered in July 2008 and a redesigned ARMLS.com website with self-service customer management due in spring ’09. He has opened dialogs with other Arizona MLSs about data sharing and system interconnectivity. Bemis is a regular participant on national panels and forums dealing with real estate issues and serves on the National Association of REALTORS® MLS Issues and Policies Committee. He began his real estate career nearly 20 years ago in Chicago as a sales associate with Coldwell Banker and prior to that was a television production executive.

Bob Bemis: Thanks for the opportunity to participate. I certainly don’t have the perspective of agents on the street, but from the lofty perch of the corner office of the MLS, I can see some trends and offer some opinions. Just remember – they’re worth exactly what you’re paying for them.

The economy in general, and the housing economy specifically, both hinge on three key factors:

(1) JOBS – the unemployment rate continues to rise, and with the threat of a more severe economic downturn the threat of higher unemployment grows daily. Without jobs, regardless of the low mortgage rates, people can’t buy houses. Companies are not creating jobs and often are not filling vacancies because of the uncertain business climate. That makes it harder for those being laid off or downsized (what a horrible word) to find new employment.

(2) TRUST – until we get a government in Washington that we can trust, there is no confidence that those making financial policy at the highest levels are making the right decisions, and moreover that they will stick with them. The “crisis” came out of nowhere with Henry Paulsen screaming that the sky was falling and doom was just around the corner unless we ponied up $750 Billion practically overnight. They were going to buy bad assets to loosen the money supply. Two weeks later they changed the entire game plan and started buying bank stock instead. The banks still are not being held accountable for what they did with that capital infusion, making them not only UN-trusted but appearing aloof and seemingly unaccountable. That has to change.

(3) FEAR – with such uncertainty in the stock and job markets and such distrust in Washington, it’s no wonder people are scared. Scared people do not buy things. They save, not for the rainy day that may be coming, but for the thunderstorm in which they find themselves now. Fear is the first symptom to set upon us and will be the last to leave. It will not happen soon.

With that little editorial, let’s get to the questions.

“What’s the chance residential resale housing prices hit bottom in 2009?”

Bob Bemis: 50-50. At best we will see a slower decline through the summer and may bottom out in the fall, but with the glut of underpriced foreclosed properties still on the market, and more to come when the next round of bad mortgages reset in the spring and renew the flow of REOs, we have a long way to go before the foreclosed properties are flushed out and the true resales again figure into the average sale price calculation.

“The median resale SFR price in November in ARMLS was $155,000. What do you think it will be in November 2009?”

Bob Bemis: The $155 figure is over 30% lower than it was a year earlier in November 2007. It’s where median prices were in the summer and fall of 2003, five years ago. As I said earlier, I think the prices will continue to slide, albeit at a lower rate. The year before our last $150 median was 2002 when prices ranged between $135 to $145. That’s not out of reach for the coming year.

“What surprise or surprises will we be talking about a year from now?”

Bob Bemis: I truly believe the housing industry, the lending industry, and the banking industry cannot individually or collectively survive the cumulative damage done to MILLIONS of credit ratings by the foreclosures and short sales that we are experiencing now. I think the Fair Isaac credit scoring system will, at worst, implode or, at best, become so unreliable that lenders will throw it out. Having a foreclosure or short sale deficiency judgment on your record in 2007-08 may become a non-factor in rating your future credit worthiness, particularly for mortgages, as lenders see the anomaly for what it is – a blip in the continuum of housing as the American dream.

“What’s the overall metropolitan Phoenix resale housing outlook for 2009?”

Bob Bemis: Overall, continued bleak and dreary until the path changes. If the Obama administration can put trust and faith back in the financial markets, remove the fear that permeates the country, and add a couple million new jobs to the workforce, then we’ll start to see the light at the end of the tunnel. How fast they can do that will determine how quickly this bursting housing bubble can start inflating again.

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{ 12 comments… read them below or add one }

1

rob 01.04.09 at 8:09 am

“Having a foreclosure or short sale deficiency judgment on your record in 2007-08 may become a non-factor in rating your future credit worthiness, particularly for mortgages, as lenders see the anomaly for what it is .”

This is one of the biggest problems before us. If you have no equity or negative equity in your home home, and you can walk with no ill effects, why wouldn’t you.

Until this is fixed home prices will continue to fall. In my entire life I have known three people who have lost their homes to foreclosure. All have been in the last 18 months and all were because the homes became worth less than what was owed. All three could have kept their homes if they wanted. One family let their home go 18 months ago and their credit score has still not been hit. They left a monthly payment of $1,700 per month for a better home at $900 a month.

My wife and I even discussed this yesterday . There is a new home I saw listed here, MLS 4094918. It’s listed for $694,000. We looked at this home in 2007, it was listed for 1.6 mil. It is a beautiful home, and for 694k it’s unbelievable. My wife said why don’t we walk from our current home that we can’t sell and just buy this one. The only reason is our credit score.

By the way, I’m not an agent and have no vested interest but if you need a house you need to look at this one.

2

Brian 01.04.09 at 12:18 pm

John

As your resident amateur economist, I would like to offer up an article from one leg of the PIMCO triumvirate (Paul McCulley, the others being Bill Gross and Mohamend El-Erian) who rule the private sector bond world.

McCulley is the Central Bank expert of the group and his expertise is near Nobel Laureate in its quality and insight. I thought some of your readers who are “interested” in economics and central bank policy, might find this article insightful. Here is a sample:

(It is the explicit responsibility of the Fed to provide a “more than proportionate” response to an economic contraction). That is indeed what is needed to save capitalism from its inherent debt-deflation pathologies. The paradox of deleveraging and the paradox of thrift are beasts of burden that capitalism simply can’t bear alone (that is to say, Capitalism is not a perfect economic system, but occassionally needs help when excess greed or fear get in the way). Only the Minsky Solution can lift that load.”

Here is the entire article: http://www.pimco.com/LeftNav/Featured+Market+Commentary/FF/2008/GCB+December+2008+McCulley+All+In.htm

3

Brian 01.04.09 at 12:32 pm

I also want to comment on Bob Bemis: what a breath of fresh air! If only the NAR had been this honest and straight forward three or four years ago, maybe we would have avoided some of the worst damage to the RE market (remember those outrageous calls that association economist David Lareah was making in 2006-07? He was the Pied Piper leading the lemmings over the cliff).

4

John Wake 01.04.09 at 12:35 pm

Rob, This may be a bit off topic but when you talk about an individual home, my automatic response is to research it. That home in north Scottsdale you mentioned sold on 8/14/07 for $1,540,000 with a $1,000,000 mortgage. It was listed in late June, 2008 for $999,000. (That didn’t take long!) The price was reduced to $899,000 in July, to $799,000 in August, to $699,000 in September but then was RAISED to $770,000 in October (!) before the listing was canceled on Halloween. A new agent listed it on January 1 for the current $694,900. The only ding I notice is that it backs to Westland Rd but Westland isn’t a major road, more like a busy residential road. I’ve been in other homes in that community and they were gorgeous!

To get back on topic, that home is an extreme example of how fast and how far the market has changed and the problems the banks face.

5

Brian 01.04.09 at 12:56 pm

The problems the banks face??!! What about the guy who just lost $540K in less than one year (the apparent down payment on that house with the $1M mortgage). How could somebody with that kind of downstroke get foreclosed so quickly? Must be some kind of story. I genuinely feel sorry for that person (as opposed to the zero down “flippers” and other leachs on our financial system).

6

rob 01.04.09 at 1:33 pm

John,
Thanks for the info on the property, very interesting and sad. The house right next door to the (west) was for sale at the same time. If I remember correctly it was listed for 1.8. Both houses are very similar, built by the same builder, at the same time. I hope that guy didn’t drop 1.8.

It’s a perfect example of the problem. The neighbor paid 1.8 mil for a home and a year and a half later he could buy a very similar house next door for less than 700k. Assuming the neighbor has a large mortgage, what would be his reason to stay if he could walk away with his credit in tact. He could move next door less than half the price …………..WOW

7

John Wake 01.04.09 at 2:51 pm

Brian, I’m trying to get a feel for how this will affect the future real estate market. Thus my focus is on the macro effect such transactions might have on the banking industry and possible future ramifications for my buyer and seller clients.

The previous owner’s personal loss on that home may be tragic but may also be just an expensive lesson. People who buy in that price range often have substantial non-housing assets.

I feel more sympathy for those who put down their life savings on a $200,000 home that was foreclosed on.

8

Brian 01.04.09 at 4:02 pm

Its an expensive lesson all right. And for someone who will be buying in Scottsdale at some point, the lesson I am learning is that it is very dangerous to try and catch the “falling knife” during this real estate rout. I wonder how many others are learning this lesson and if it is changing their thinking about when to buy.

The market decline was already one year underway when this transaction went down. The owner would have known there was risk in buying the house at that time, but probably thought the market would not go much lower. He may be wealthy, but not only did the past owner lose over $500K, but by walking away or getting foreclosed, that buyer has hurt his credit badly. You have to be REALLY well off not to care about your credit rating.

Did you see that this house also had a transaction in November for $892K on Nov. 6? What could have happened in that short time for it to come back on the market at $200K less?

9

John Wake 01.04.09 at 7:03 pm

Nov. 6 was the foreclosure sale when it went back to the bank. The previous listing was a potential short sale. The current listing is bank owned.

BTW, that link above to McCulley’s piece was fantastic. Nice find, an economist who can write in an entertaining way. Now I’m checking out Minsky.

10

John Wake 01.04.09 at 7:54 pm

BTW, when a lender repossesses a property, the “sale price” is no such thing. No money changed hands. There was no sale. When a lender takes back ownership they usually tell the County Recorder that the “sale price” was whatever the lender used as its opening price during the failed foreclosure auction. Lenders usually make the outstanding loan amount as the opening bid so that means the “sale price” in a repossession is usually the outstanding loan amount. Correct me if I’m wrong.

11

Brian 01.04.09 at 8:48 pm

John, if you are a newcomer to these monthly newsletters from PIMCO, I suggest getting on their email list. This is the best stuff I read every month, except for my Barrons subscription, which interviews this team extensively and frequently.

Bill Gross is the originator of the idea of the “Shadow Banking” system (I think), which came to dwarf the Federal Reserve system in the last 10 years, making central bank policy implementation difficult, if not impossible. Shadow banking is the creation of money from nothing by private institutions (like hedge funds) that were increasingly deregulated in the 1990s and 2000s. Because these lightly regulated institutions could use instruments like the “carry trade” to create money with very little capital, by use of massive leverage, the system effectively grew the money supply outside the control of the Central Bank.

Now, that the shadow banking system is collapsing, it is following exactly the Minsky model. The Minsky Moment, modeled as the “Ponzi Unit”, was achieved almost exactly at the time the biggest real-life ponzi scheme was uncovered, the Madoff Fund. Talk about life imitating art!!

So, the real central bank must transfer the leverage that is disappearing in the private sector, to the public sector, in order that the economy does not collapse into oblivion. I would like to ask Mr. McCulley what is the step to follow in the Minsky Model: how does the leverage that the public sector absorbs from the private sector get resolved? By time alone?

You might find an earlier article describing “Shadow Banking” written by Bill Gross a year ago, equally interesting. It fortells everything that has happened. I have been reading the PIMCO articles for a few years, so I knew their thinking and had little exposure to RE the past two years, except my home. But like McCulley, who knew the crisis would go so far beyond the mortgage market?

http://www.pimco.com/LeftNav/Featured+Market+Commentary/IO/2008/IO+January+2008.htm

12

Derek Jarr 01.04.09 at 9:59 pm

John good work on your blog! The only way this market will get back to normal is by Agents figuring out how to sell short sales and foreclosures & for the banks to take hits and move on. It is simple economics supply and demand, just need to work through the inventory. The more loan modifications they do without reducing the principal debt and the more banks postponing foreclosures without an offer will just delay the recovery. Money is cheap but not easy, however if you actually make money and can prove it you can get a loan for as little as 5% down. If people don’t have 5% to put down they should not be buying the home anyway.

For the record Short Sales do work, we closed $50 million+ last year. This market is good for buyers and agents who know what to do.

Best of luck.

Derek
http://www.LiveFreeInvestmentGroup.com

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